131mirafiori forum

Hi to all

Would there be demand for an after-installation AC unit for the 131?
I used to work as developing engineer for AC Systems for Modine (OE supplier to fiat) and of course it is still my wish to put AC in our 131 (I also did this with my MB 250 coupe
I saw some pics of the factory AC (made by autoclima) on the forum.
It will be difficult to build an OE copy as a the compressor is no longer available I think...
Anyhow, I have a few suppliers willing to make small volume on Condensers, Evaps etc.
The heater/AC casing will be the most difficult to built as AC also requires recirc.

Firstly I want to investigate if there would be demand and for what engines (compressor bracket)
I think if we  have 25 members interested we can build something.

PS: for me this would be hobby, so non profit.

cheers
Henk

interesting idea, if you can make it at the right price. any idea how much it could cost?

Is there going to be any difference in mounting/setup between LH and RH drive cars?

I would say it would cost between  Euro 650-850 depending on how many we can built (you have to install it your self of course)
If we want an oe Copy of condenser (left side of radiator) it would require a min. order quantity of 25 piese to get a reasonable price.
Only think I can not realy estimate right now is the HVAC casing
It would be ideal if we can convert the existing heatercase by adding evaporator and new blower module with recirc.
Sofar two members replied to this idea
Mabey I first build one prototype (with non OE condenser) and let you guys know if it worked and against what price...

Any suggestions? let me know and if anyone has an old OE  HVAC casing that would be a great help

Merry Christmas
Henk

I do not think so but I am not sure...
Is the OE LHD heatercasing different from RHD?
In many cases the only difference would be the position of the controls in the dash
With older cars the often used the same controls and HVAC casing but that is not a writen rule
See attached pic of LHD controls

I do have wiring diagrams from an old Haynes manual and also some pics of OE Autoclima casing
If anyone has more writin documentation, please share this with me

I believe the heater controls are different for RHD and LHD.

The push-button A/C controls are the same as Lancia models of the time (Beta, Gamma).

frankly, i believe that it can be obtained at lower price from our turkish parts supplier.

Interesting... would that be with all new parts?
I asked Yagmur if he could supply HVAC casing but he told me that the only way would be from the scrap yard.
Anyways, a complete system would require folling parts,

Under bonnet: Compressor, compressor bracket, crankshaft pully, tensioner, condenser, condenserfan, drier/receiver bottle, pressure switch, 4 hoses and wiringloom with relay's

Interior: Modified Heatercasing with new blowermotor and recirc. flaps, evaporator, expansion valve, thermostat and controls with wiringloom

PS; the system will be suitable for R-134a refrigerant (enviromental friendly as the old R12 is prohibited in most country's)

anyways, if you could do it for, let's say 600e than i believe you could make quite a few of those units. also, same compressors, bracketry and hoses, possibly internal units could be used with little or no modification for other old fiats such as 124, 124 spider, 125, 132

I have complete system laying in (USA) garage for shipping costs only if needed for reference.

That would be great!
Is that including complete HVAC casing and controls?
I can ask UPS or DHL to pick it up if you can tell size and dims

Cheers
Henk

I will need some way to control the heat, rally car build ;D, if I can find a solution for this once the dashboard is complete the controls can come along. Maybe I can use 124 spider unit to control my heat. :-\  I will take some pics tomorrow and post along with some dimensions of box it will ship in, in a day or two.

Cheers

Do you only need controls for heating the interior?
What kind of heating system do you have right now?
Maybe I can get you something....
regards

Hi Henk, sorry for the delay. I will need to keep the casing and blower assembly. All else I think can be yours as pictured. Let me know if you need more detailed shots or info. The box will be 30-34" sq. and 9-11" deep. I will need to find a series 1 or 1 & 1/2 control/switch unit. Any help will be appreciated. Maybe Guy Moerenhout will have a casing.
Cheers

another shot

Hi, I think you also need the OE control as in pic 1. or can you use controls of the heater only version? I can get this no problem...
Basically I have interest in the condenser and in the control unit, I will not need the rest (hoses, compressor as I can make these new, however a compressor bracket would be nice, is still on your engine?)

Cheers, Henk

I think I can locate a heater only control but if you have one that would be great. I have a cut-out for the series 1 style control in my metal dash. I do have the compressor bracket and will send it. Do you need the fan mounted or taken off to save weight and size of packaging. If you could locate a casing and blower assembly for a heater only I think we could swap if this one will help you out since it has the A/C in/output on it and it will save weight in my car. I can take a picture of it if necessary. I travel quite a bit so sometimes I cannot respond quickly. I will PM you my work email.
Cheers

Do you have pics of the entire process? It would be a priceless contribution for those who would try this assembly, I'd like to see the heater/cooler unit in pics. Can the 131 A/C play as an heat pump also?

Normally on European cars, it requires complete dash removal to install AC, different from Japenese were the evap. was slided in underneath the glove box and everthing else (recirc. and wiringloom) was pre-installed
In General we would quote for 2 days labor for a complete install as most European cars were not prepared for AC

A heat pump would make sense if there is no heater but performance and efficientcy is poor (Only for not too cold countries)
Basically an AC system pumps heat from the interior to the outside by absorbing heat in the underdash evaporator and reject it by condensing it at the condenser (in front of radiator) In the reverse mode (by means of a 3-way valve) the evaporator becomes condenser (Rejecting heat) and the condenser becomes evap.(Absorbing heat) In this mode it is absorbing heat from the outside and "pumps" it into the interior.
It is instant heat (direct available) but you can imagine that there is not much heat to absorb from the outside when it is freezing outside.. basically your are pumping the compressor energy (=heat) inside.

Heat pump mode is not realy used in the automotive industry but is getting a topic now with Hybrid cars and efficient diesel engines were there is less waste "coolant heat"
Toyota uses a "hot Gas" systems (heat pump similar system) on some diesel engines as a "cheap auxillary heater"

If there is interest for a more detailed explaniation (physics etc.) let me know.

Cheers
Henk

As you can see some North America fiat 131 came with "japanese" system, but I have never seen one like that in person:

(http://i49.tinypic.com/9hmmmw.jpg)

(photo from another post on this same forum)

Thank you very much for your explanation Henk, I asked about heater because my old 131 service instructions says something about a button with a dot in the dash that makes the system play as an heater, maybe it only allows warm water passage. I know how it work a heat pump, and I thought a luxury car could need instant heat for passengers in the morning when coolant is cold.

All right....I forgott to mention the so called "underdash" (Recirc only, stand-alone ac)
this one sure is still in good shape...

PS: I think the  dotted button shuts off the AC Compressor and / or opens the heater valve or something like that..
I have to take a look at the wiring diagram to be sure but it would suprise me if they build in a heatpump mode...

i like the last pic  where can we buy that

i am from egypt
and  i have fiat 131 1979 1600 tc  i have heater in it and i want to install ac many told me to remove the heater and install ac with outunite like this(http://1.1.1.5/bmi/www10.0zz0.com/2012/06/05/21/737923509.jpg)

but i want to keep me car as original

SEAT 2000 'Diplomatic' made in Spain, standard fitment! spares still available over the counter ;D

Did someone install an aftermarket underdash or indash evaporator? Is there enough space between firewall and dashboard? The underdash option doesn't look the best option because the passenger get's all the cold air. Indash tubing and 3 or 4 underdash outlets looks better in my opinion.

I wrecked an A/C 131 a few years ago, I still have the engine with compressor bracket attached, (no compressor). I've also got the under dash heater/cooler unit and the in dash controls.

Thanks Tas131,

I keep that option in my mind.