131mirafiori forum

Hello everybody, I'm facing a problem with a rusted MkIII supermirafiori, the central pillar is totally gone, the low end part is badly rusted and cracked, so when I drive it, it sounds like there is no more link between chassis and roof on this side. Door clings and cracks, lots of noise from there. Do you know if I can just change the lower part of the pillar or need the under door panel too? This is a picture of the situation, there is a lot of concrete covering the totally rusted pillar. I think it should be welded to the reinforcement going from side to side, isn't it?


(http://i52.tinypic.com/e5jva9.jpg)

I would start by cleaning all the paint off the area to see exactly what is what.

hello, there has been rust from 15 years or so there, but the sill seems to be good, just the b pillar showing rust. You can put a screwdriver in, so the part is totally gone. Can I just buy the pillar and cut the lower part and weld as it is or will need some reinforcement welding before?

You should be able to weld in a repair section. I would tack it in place and check the door allignment carefully before seam welding in place.

anyway rear door will need to be removed before, and inner plastic parts and bits too. But, how much important is the pillar basis structuraly? Could noise come from inner steel parts failure?

It's hard to say but if you remove the damaged area you should be able to see the inner structure and inspect it.

Hello, I have inspected the rear side of this part and discoverede that it's all perfect except for the part I have marked in blue:


(http://i53.tinypic.com/rrjmtg.jpg)


Do you think is possible to ask the man that will repair it to put a steel patch and weld with no need of original parts? The new pillar would remain allmost unsused except for this tiny part, so I would not buy all this not necessary stuff...... ???

Don't you think yourself it's easier and cheaper to just weld in a small piece of metal? Therefor you don't have need of the whole pillar.

Yes but the problem is that this is a structural part and I need strenght to achieve reliability.....

Take a piece of 4 mm or 5 mm sheet metal and bend it in the right form. Cut away the rusted part en weld in the new one. It should be strong enough.

Have you tried bending 4 or 5mm sheet? :-\

I cant remember off hand but I would guess this part originally was probably 1.2mm outer skin with a 2mm reinforcement inside.

Do you know if it's possible for a garage to remake the lower end of this part without need of original parts?

Somebody experienced in body repairs should be able to make thic piece yes. Alternatively if you can find a scrap 131 where this piece is solid you could cut it out and use it to repair yours. This is why I usually chop up my scrap shells and keep any non rusty bits for re-use ;)

Personally - I would remove all the ancillary trim and take a grinder to it - I think that you will find a lot more damage than you think.
For a 'filler' repair in that area usually means there are a lot more problems !!
Sorry !! Just my opinion - strip it right back and take another photo !!

I agree with Curt, its always more than double amount of rust than you can see in these parts of the car from experience!

You start cut in the rusted area and then put the weld to it and just blubbers,then you have to cut out more, when you are finisched you replaced the hole part anyway, with a lot more work and looking worse..

Just my opinion!
Regards Alf

I must agree too. I think it will be not just the pillar. That's why i suggested 4 or 5 mmm sheet metal. To bring back the stiffnes.
On the other hand i must say that i never saw a B-pillar that was so bad as this one seems to be. Wonder why this part is so rusted. And how about the lower part?

Just use metal that is at least as thick as the original and you will be fine. Another thing to consider is that if you use metal that is much thicker than the original then welding two different thicknesses can become difficult.

You can never really tell how bad things are until you get in there. Things are often worse than expected ::)

I used to see damage in this area quite a lot - usual problem was when the inertia reel seat belts didnt retract properly. The metal tang of the seat belt used to drop  to the sill and people would slam the doors on them taking nicks and gouges from that area - and then off course - in came the tin worm !! ;)

I have inspected the rear side of the pillar, taking off all the ancillaries and plastics, and the response is that there is only rust in the low end of the pillar, rust just stops abruptly and the rest of the pillar is fine. The sill is good in that place, no rust, inner steel pillar panel too, so I think it's just a factory fault of that part and this is why I would repair it without changing parts, it's too little and localized to change parts.

The base of the pillar sits down onto the sill and is spot welded.  From the damage I would say water has run down inside the pillar and collected in the bottom.  It rusts around the spot welds, and the pillar eventually cracks and rusts away.
Damage like this should be repaired in layers to make sure it is strong, and lasts longer than 5 minutes!
Try holding the rear door by one end and you will see just how much load this pillar has to support!

To repair:

Strip the area and remove the rear door.
Make sure the inner pillar face is sound, or repair it.
Cut away the bottom 2" of the outer pillar.
Grind the remains off the sill and remove all rust.
Repair the sill!  If the outer is this rusty, the sill will be holed.
Make a repair for the lower pillar in 20 swg or 22 swg steel.
Seam weld to pillar and plug weld to sill.

If you can't do it, or get it done, I 'm in Wiltshire and have 25+ years experience with Fiat/Lancia/Alfa repairs.

Thank you for your answer, I'm in Italy and I'm looking for a good repair shop, and I need to know if it can be repaired without a spare central pillar, but with a new outer sill only (which is easy to find and cheap).
Regards

This damage can be repaired by cutting out the rot and shaping sheet metal to replce those areas.
It's not a difficult repair, but take the time to do it properly if you intend to keep the car.

Good luck!

Hi!
Hope its only that part that is rotten, here where i live they put salt out in the winter that eats all cars and if its rusted o hole in some place  almost all of it is as bad but not yet hole!
Please Keep us uppdated and show the result,

Regards Alf

just waiting for leaving the car to a body shop and have an ultimate sentence. I'll keep you updated.