131mirafiori forum

Hi, I decided to change my car that is in a poor state half-eaten by rust with a "new" one claiming just 94000Km (~60K miles) and original state. It is a 1980 Mirafiori 1600 and its being sold for some 1025 euro. But I love my 2000/TC and don?t want to lose it, so my plan is to upgrade the 1600 to a 2000 Super.
So I?m asking for advice whether there are some dificulties in the process of changing the engine with gearbox and if also a change of the propeller shaft and rear axle is required..?
Thanx for replys

I did this same swap. Very easy. Currently I still have the 1600 axle and diff, but I would recommend using the 2 litre axle, as I find that you run out of each gear too quickly with the 1600 one. I also believe that the 2 litre axle is wider. I fitted the 2 litre front suspension too, therefore giving me power steering. 

Thanx for a pleasing reply.
But I?m afraid the same swap did already the previous user of my todays 2litre. The gears seem to be quite short as I can cruise 60km/h in 5th gear at 1500rpm with no problem. At 80km/h its 2500rpm.
Do you have the same revs?
In this case i would need to find a 2litre axle with a longer ratio, ideally a disc brake fitted axle from a 132 or Argenta, but that would be a task here.

Finding a disc braked rear axle is difficult here too. In the UK at least discs were only fitted to early 132s. Later ones and the Argenta only had rear drums here. I think the gears are too short. 100 Km/h is 60 miles an hour, if you are doing 2500 RPM at 80Km/h I think that is too high. The 2 litre twin cam has much more torque and you do not get the best for it if you are always using high revs. I plan to fit a two litre rear axle to my 131 but have not got around to it yet! It is not that urgent for me as the car is currently in dry storage.

I think Haynes claims that 1600 OHV and 2000 TC diffs are the same.

Yes, it would be a luck to find some discs rear axle, but on the other side there must have been a good reason why Fiat didn?t fitted the later 132s or even the 131 Sports or Volumetricos with disc brakes on the rear..
So I?ll probably do with a new set of rear drums if at least I find a standart 2L rear axle.
On carfolio.com I found the same 3.9 final drive for 1600 ohv, 1600 dohc and 2000, none for 1600 ohc, that I?ll be buying.
But on a copy of Italian manual there is a 3.58 ratio for a 2L manual and 1,6 automatic
and 3.42 for a 2L automatic. I wonder what is the ratio for a 2,5D automatic as it should be the longest one..

My car was originally a Series 3 1600CL 5 speed with the single OHC 1600 engine. It is now fitted with the 2 litre DOHC engine but same 5 speed box and rear axle. The 1600 OHV cars may have had the same rear axle ratio if they were 4 speed, but having the 2 Litre with 5 speed means you benefit from a different axle ratio. As far as I know the only reason Fiat went to drums and not discs on the rear was for reasons of cost. Just like on the early series 2 Supermirafioris the interiors were all velour, and on the later ones they replaced parts of the seat material with vinyl. When it got to the Series 3 Supermirafiori most had rubbish seat material that shreaded in no time!

PS I'm away at the moment so I am not able to consult my manuals and data, I will do so when I get back. Also, I have to say that my Supermirafiori with it's 2 litre twin cam has standard 131 brakes and they are excellent in my opinion.

I colected these ratios for given cars:
131 1.6L man ...4.1
131 1.6L aut   ...3.58
131 2.0L man  ...3.58
131 2.0L auto  ...3.42

132 2.0L man    ...3.73
132 2.0L aut      ...3.42
132 2.5D man     ...3.73
132 1.8ES man    ...4.1 disc
132 1.6GLS man    ...4.1 disc

Argenta 2.0 SX/VX  ...3.42 disc 257/227
Argenta 1.6           ...4.1
Argenta 2.5D           ...3.73
Argenta 2.5TD         ...3.15 disc

Whoo, have to find this Argenta TD axle :)

sorry for intrusion but your data doesn't seem to be all correct.

i've driven argenta 2.5td and it had rear drum brakes.

i now have 132 2.5diesel and 132 2.0petrol and diesel's diff ratio is definately longer than on 2.0.

also, i've fitted rear disc brakes from 132 1800gls on my 132d's original rear axle, and it's no big deal, a day's job. it brakes much better now.

i also have a '82. 131 1600cl (sohc) and 5 speed box, diff seems to be very long ratio, compared to my lada 2104 1.8tc with 4.3 diff. much bigger diference than 4.1 to 4.3.

Any chance you could post a picture of your Lada!! ;).Eugene

1995 lada 2104 with 1.8tc (111bhp) from steyr fiat 132 special and gearbox from 132 1800gls and many other modifications http://lada-klub.com/viewtopic.php?t=1182
shortest possible diff ratio 4.3, shortened springs, gas shocks, 7*13 rims and 205/60/13 tyres... 0-100km/h 9sec. 100-170km/h (top speed) further 12sec. abarth intake and exaust manifolds and cams, 55mm exaust piping...

by the way, how do i make a picture appear in my posts instead of just a link?

In another thread there were questions raised on brake balance. Do you have brake balance problems? Please inform us of your experience.

rear brakes are much stronger now than before.

according to MOT brake test, front brakes are 2.8-3 on the scale ( don't know what those numbers actualy mean) and rear are 1.2-1.4 (drums were 0.8 and front same as now)

in real life it means that wery strong braking on wet road may lock up rear wheels sooner than front. if youre experienced driver it's no problem at all. wider rear tyres (205/60/14) also help to compensate for that.
thing that fascinates me is that since i installed rear discs i never had brakes overheating problems as before and high speed braking (150km/h-0) is excellent.

Thanx for your input with the experiences, these are positive informations for me.

The carfolio.com page where I was picking the values seems to have a lot of mistakes and/or there maybe also varieties in used diff ratios for cars with the same engine I think.

At first I?ll probably meassure the diffs ratio by hand and see whats the situation before starting a search for a new axle.

rear axle from steyr fiat 132 special. limited slip diff (4.1) and disc brakes all in one 8)

upper and lower control arms same as on 131, panhard rod mount needs to be fabricated and welded on to fit on 131.

no i wont sell it, i need it for my 132 drift car project? ;D , and it would be a bit comlicated to send it from serbia to ireland? ::)

Oh yes, you have a nice combo there. If sending to Ireland seems to be a problem, just send it here to Czech rep:)

you wish! poke around in austria, you're bound to find one. it's from austrian steyr fiat 132. as you probably know, steyr is better known for their off road vehicles, so lim.slip diff is their speciality

Yes i know about Steyr, thanx for the tip. Austria is not far from here, so i could probably do a trip there if i don?t find anything nice around here.

Hi, I found a ?73 Fiat 132 1.6 Special for sale in a poor condition, but with the disc axle in. I?d like to ask if i could mount the calipers to a 131 axle straight or i need to weld some fixture for it?
Exactly the part that is not visible on your photo of the axle here :D
thanx

hmmm.... 1600 special....
rare as bird's milk.
would be a real shame to scrap it.
how bad condition?

I?m posting it as a new thred as a 132 for sale...

discs on 132 rear axle
i hope that you can see on these what you wanted to know

Thanx for the pics djape , if i see it right the brakers and discs are the same as on the front of a 131, but to be honest i don?t see much of what i needed ... the mounts of the braker (caliper?) on the axle. How are they conected to the axle, that is what i was curious about.
Sorry if i didn?t express myself clearly ::)

Hi Ale?,

I just picked up on your thread and I hope this might help.

My Volumetrico has a modified 132 rear axle with disc brakes so see attached pic.

The ends of the 132 axle have a 10mm thick mounting plates for the caliper cages to bolt onto.
These plates are held on by 4 bolts that go into the end flanges of the axle.

The plates and calipers are also found on the 124 Spider 2000 rear axle.

I have tried to outline the plate in the pic but it is a bit grainy.

G

Oh i see now!
I was a bit confused, but it?s clear now.
Thank you guys!

A Spider 2000 is even more rare than a 132 here and i know about just one 132 ...
So i?m thinking about going for it, because the price for the whole car is probably less than for what i could have the brake adaptors done. I?m just not sure if the owner will be happy to hear i?m not gonna save it...but i don?t want to lie about it, damn.

I've got a 132 disc rear end in a 131 I'm wrecking. Is the 132 rear end the same width as the standard 131 rear end? I've got a set of 6" x 15" wheels on my car, they just fit inside the rear guards. If the 132 rear is any wider I won't be able to fit it without butchering the bodywork.

It should be wider just as much as those two
That means you have just added the Panhard rod? Or any other modifications?

The whole rear axle is an old conversion done sometime in the 80's by a 131 racer called  N. Buttrice.
The pickups for the sway bars and Panhard rod are all original 131 and have been welded in the correct posititions on the 132 axle.
I think it was the only way at that time to get a reliable rear end without building a Fiat/Ford hybrid.

I refurbished the whole thing and fitted it to my car when the diff let go in the original 131 axle.

It could be wider but because I did not compare the axles when they were both off of the car I'm not sure....all I know is that there is plenty of clearence on the outer face of the Revolution wheels that I use, so much clearence that many have suggested that I fit spacers behind the wheels to make the rims fill the arches better.

If your wheels rub you can always fold the arch lip flat under the top of the arch to make the gap, if not enough then you can machine the back of the rim and the disc/hub face slightly to again give the neccessary space.
Its all trial and error and plenty of offering up to check gapping. 

I hope this is not putting you off, I've found that the advantages of having the stronger 132 rear have made my car a much better drive and it doesn't lock wheels up.....incidently...when I took my car for its MOT the tester was gobsmacked by its overall (F&R) breaking strength on the rollers, he said it had more than a modern Ford Mondeo with discs all round...not bad for a 26 yr old car  ;).     

i wrote in some other thread about brake conversion on my 132d. same thing as with gremlino's 131. extremly good braking!